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REVIEW: The Grimm Variations Anime Series Review


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Princess_Irene
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Joined: 16 Dec 2008
Posts: 2612
Location: The castle beyond the Goblin City
PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2024 6:16 am Reply with quote
whiskeyii wrote:
I have a strong suspicion that Elves and the Shoemaker suffers from some differing cultural context around “cheating”. In Japan, cheating is considered just about the worst thing you can do (to the point that it’s been edited out as a subplot for certain shows to make heroic characters more palatable to Japanese audiences), and I wonder if the conceit of having a protagonist who basically had someone doing all the work for him without giving it a fair shake himself was just hewing too close to that idea to be anything but negativity perceived for that audience. Just a thought.


I think there's a lot to that theory - the Japanese variants of the tale type (ATU503) always have two main characters, one who is good and hardworking and one who is bad and lazy. Whereas the German variant features a poor, hardworking man who is rewarded for his kindness by the elves, who then leave when he and his wife are able to pay them back, and thus are in a better (financial) place, the Japanese versions take pains to show that you must be good or be punished. Unlike the Shoemaker, the guy in this show was emphatically NOT grateful and had no intention of rewarding his helper. You can read two Japanese variants in this book: https://archive.org/details/folktalesofjapan00seki/page/126/mode/2up
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whiskeyii



Joined: 29 May 2013
Posts: 2247
PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2024 9:06 am Reply with quote
AverageAnimeFan wrote:
Interesting that you mention that because I recently saw this video that implies basically the opposite of your statement and at the time it was too hard to believe. I just assume it's fake now.


I should have clarified I meant “cheating” in the academic/achievement variety, not adultery. Laughing I’m pretty sure that video is shot in Kamurocho, an area (in)famous for its red-light district, so the answers are probably skewed very differently towards the consumer base inclined to frequent there.

@Shay Guy: I did think of that series, but I actually had RWBY in mind, which has a prominent side character fake their entrance exam scores prior to the show proper. That whole subplot was cut for the initial broadcast since he would basically become a pariah in the Japanese fandom’s eyes if it were kept in. I’m not even sure if it was included in the home release versions or not.
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Shay Guy



Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 2131
PostPosted: Wed May 01, 2024 12:29 pm Reply with quote
Princess_Irene wrote:
I think there's a lot to that theory - the Japanese variants of the tale type (ATU503) always have two main characters, one who is good and hardworking and one who is bad and lazy. Whereas the German variant features a poor, hardworking man who is rewarded for his kindness by the elves, who then leave when he and his wife are able to pay them back, and thus are in a better (financial) place, the Japanese versions take pains to show that you must be good or be punished. Unlike the Shoemaker, the guy in this show was emphatically NOT grateful and had no intention of rewarding his helper. You can read two Japanese variants in this book: https://archive.org/details/folktalesofjapan00seki/page/126/mode/2up


I've had the idea for a long time that under Manga Morality, "hard work" is practically the only virtue there is, or at least the only one that matters, superseding all others. Most obviously in shonen manga (the "doryoku" in the old Jump motto), but also showing up in other manga and anime. Which can be kinda rough on a manga fan who struggles with depression and lack of motivation. Confused (I've even noticed cases where a work nominally sympathetic to depression makes sure to make the depressed character a "good depressed" person, whose ability to Work Hard isn't inhibited by their depression.)

Interesting to think that this might have deeper cultural roots than I realized.

whiskeyii wrote:
I did think of that series, but I actually had RWBY in mind, which has a prominent side character fake their entrance exam scores prior to the show proper. That whole subplot was cut for the initial broadcast since he would basically become a pariah in the Japanese fandom’s eyes if it were kept in. I’m not even sure if it was included in the home release versions or not.


Ha! I hadn't read about any cuts, but I remember that plot point in Volume 1, and I can believe it. The character's general concept is really more of an American fandom archetype, honestly, despite the show as a whole being an anime pastiche. (See: Xander, Sokka.) I remember reading some fan reactions to the effect of "cheating his way in is honestly an impressive feat", even speculating that the headmaster figured it out and let him in anyway out of appreciation.

…You know, in this light, the first test in Naruto's Chunin Exam arc is pretty unconventional for a battle manga, and now I'm a little curious how it was received back in 2000. Looks like in the latter part of that year, it had its ups and downs, but was consistently placed in the front half of Jump -- never on par with One Piece, but did tend to jockey for position with The Prince of Tennis, Hikaru no Go, Yu-Gi-Oh, and Hunter x Hunter. (The next year, when the arc when into full tournament mode, it seems to have established itself as the clear #2 to One Piece.)

Of course nowadays, the otaku landscape has been taken over by webnovels, where it's extremely common for protagonists to have something explicitly called a "cheat power". Which I think is a loanword coming via game cheats, of the "xyzzy" variety (the Japanese Wikipedia page is mostly about video games, with a small section on the word's meaning in English), so maybe the association with "cheating" more broadly isn't as strong in Japanese.
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#HayamiLover



Joined: 22 Jul 2018
Posts: 798
Location: Eastern Europe
PostPosted: Fri May 03, 2024 4:39 pm Reply with quote
I liked the show overall, but in my opinion it just doesn't know what it wanted to be. On the one hand, you might think that before there is a variation of Black Mirror on a fairytale motif, on the other, after the first or second episode, the show trades too much depth for variety for the sake of variety. I mean, yeah, I liked the nostalgic feeling of how they turned Town Musicians of Bremen into a cheesy all-female action show from the 00s or quoted Neverland in Hansel and Gretel, but after a really smart performance in Cinderella it just feels like a twist for the sake of a twist in the spirit of old soap operas.

Also, maybe I don't know something about the anime kitchen, but how much was CLAMP involved in it? They are credited as illustrators only, but many elements in the show seem to be very heavily inspired by or directly quoting their work. From the old-fashioned yuri bait in the fifth episode to the shoujo horror in the first.

MarshalBanana wrote:
I feel this show is greater than the sum of its parts. As an overall, package, it's a creatively varied anthology, individually few of them would stand upon their feet.

I think my favourite one, was "The Town Musicians of Bremen", a very solidly made weird western. I also think it did the "women get revenge on men" troupe better than EP2.

"Cinderella" might be my second favourite, the twist becomes obvious very early on, but it was well told. Next might be

"Hansel and Gretel", I wasn't big on the spoiler[Gretel was just Hansel's imagination twist], and it did feel a bit overlong, but it was still an excellent what if story.

"Little Red Riding Hood" might be next, though the snuff porn lost its shock value for me by the end. I did really like the beginning, where it was "Little Red Riding Hood in a VR version of the Moulin Rouge". I think the main issue was length, once they had established Grey as a character, they don't really do anything with him until he goes to the old lady.

"Pied Piper of Hamelin" has some interesting theming on the dangers of sexual repression and insulated communities. I just wish it had spent more time developing Maria as a character and less time focusing on the teacher.

"The Elves and the Shoemaker"... Yeah, that was just way overlong and really boring.

I wouldn't call it "revenge". Yes, this had a strong element of feminism, but Little Red Riding Hood did not take revenge on the Wolf for his past victims, on the contrary, she teased him with words that, due to carelessness, he did not notice how the hunter pretended to be a victim. While Bremen emulated the typical story of strong women punishing tough but careless criminal men. This is not so much “women taking revenge on men”, but rather a power fantasy about how women can also be strong, and not defenseless victims.
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shosakukan



Joined: 09 Jan 2014
Posts: 294
PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2024 9:27 pm Reply with quote
whiskeyii wrote:
AverageAnimeFan wrote:
Interesting that you mention that because I recently saw this video that implies basically the opposite of your statement and at the time it was too hard to believe. I just assume it's fake now.


I should have clarified I meant “cheating” in the academic/achievement variety, not adultery. Laughing I’m pretty sure that video is shot in Kamurocho, an area (in)famous for its red-light district, so the answers are probably skewed very differently towards the consumer base inclined to frequent there.

Actually, that video was shot in Shibuya, specifically in the 'Centre-gai' area and the 'Hyakken-dana' area of Shibuya. I can recognise the areas, and also signs in the video say or suggest so.
You may have played Sega's 'Ryū ga Gotoku (Yakuza)' video games, and Kamurocho in Sega's 'Yakuza' video games is based on Kabukichō in Shinjuku.
'Hyakken-dana' literally means 'one hundred shops'. After the Great Kantō Earthquake, business tycoon Tsutsumi Yasujirō, who founded the Seibu group, invited owners of well-established businesses in the Shitamachi region of Tokyo to open new shops in the area which would later become Hyakken-dana. Kobayashi Nobuhiko, a novelist who was born in Nihonbashi and also writes books and articles on Tokyo, has inferred that the area's name 'Hyakken-dana' is derived from many shops' having opened in that area in response to Tsutsumi's invitation.
In a scene in the 'Onna no Za' film (1962, dir. by Naruse Mikio. I think film scholar Audie Bock wrote a book about Naruse), you can see the now-defunct 'Theatre Shibuya' cinema and what Hyakken-dana was like in the 1960s.
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